Nothing Resolved in Honduras Video

Note: At 08:39 the subtitle quotes Shannon as saying "Honduran democracy is NOT in the hands of Hondurans. It should read is NOW in the hands of Hondurans.

One week after a widely-celebrated, US-brokered agreement between deposed president Zelaya and coup president Micheletti, the coup regime appears stronger than ever

Save & Share:

REALHONDURAS: And the lack of preparing a budget for 2009? When most budgte proposals are submitted in January we were in JUne and he still hadnt submitted a budget for 2009, let me guess he was going to run the elections just like his referendum "Poll" ? Ballots from venezuela, administered by zelaya, counted by zelaya, and already had 450,000 votes (Dont try to argue this zelaya said it himself) before the "POlling was to take place? very scientific and accurate dont you think?

REALHONDURAS: Your giving the man too much credit as an honest man, this is a guy that admitted to wining the elections with fraud. HIs "REferendum polling" was illegal his venezuelan ballots were confiscated, then he lead a mob to break into a military base and steal them back thats what led to his legal removal of an unconstitutional president.

REALHONDURAS: a but those are accusations by a terrorist faction(The zelayista) that is trying to destabalize the peace in Honduras, all under investigation and many are false accusations, just like the RIVERS OF BLOOD zelaya claimed to be in the first days of his constitutional removal, no rivers of blood.

NicosNicosNicosNicos: "Let me guess" kind of sums it up. What did Zelaya say himself? (You may prove he spent his days raping cows, I would argue a legal process would in such an event have been legitimate, but a coup?.) Now I genuinely wonder to what extent you, or a number of others, have really swallowed the PR produced by the coup and its expensive US PR firms. How long does a grandmother's ears tail and teeth need to be before you can recognise a wolf?

NicosNicosNicosNicos: That was part of the argument used. All the Latin American coups I can remember right now were preceded by -let's call it controversy. A golpista always needs to seek some kind of legitimacy. The novelty here is the legalistic discourse, not the justification. I disapprove of fraud, but as I say, were it the case, were it indeed the problem, the solution is not an even graver crime.

NicosNicosNicosNicos: Listen, man. If you decide from day one that someone against the coup is a "Zelayista" and that Zelayista=terrorist, and that anything else that follows either confirms this or doesn't count, I say you are liable to miss some important elements of the picture. I trust people committed to Human Rights such as Amnesty more than a violent military or police investigating itself.

REALHONDURAS: Im just adressing the zelayistas (the Frente Contra el Blah blah group) I know there are people that arent for Zelaya but are against the legal removal of him, just that in HOnduras those are a small fraction, while the majority of the population support the elections in November without Zelaya in Honduras that is. There are other allegations that your not menstioning by the Zelaya supporters. There are Human rights violations on both sides and i agree they need to be investigated........

REALHONDURAS: Until then i think it would be more responsible to avoid speculation and false accusations until they are investigated. In the mean time the facts should be given more importance then speculation

REALHONDURAS: Something your not mentioning is that in all coups, all powers of state are replaced and the coup is initially run by the military by order of an unconstitutional faction. Something that didnt happen in Honduras all governmental institutes and its people are all the same before zelaya the and the military acted on a court order by the supreme court, hence not a coup, zelaya isnt king of honduras he was the president hence seperation of powers and not above the law.

NicosNicosNicosNicos: I agree that this coup is innovative in some aspects, while never ceasing to be a coup. There tend to always be several actors involved in a coup: landed oligarchy/sectors of the media/the army/foreign embassies. There is a separation of powers, and a president should not be empowered to dissolve congress or remove the S, Court if disapproving of their rulings. Likewise, the latter had no powers to remove the president, precisely because of separation of powers, amongst others.

NicosNicosNicosNicos: To avoid speculation and media manipulation is fine. Amnesty doesn't write its reports based on speculation though. Likewise you can say you have seen a burning bus on video, you don't need a court to confirm it.

REALHONDURAS: well like i said its better we stick to facts then false accusations. There always will be the same actors because the system of government is composed by the same actors but your negating one large fact the CONSTITUTION, the rule of law for every nation is different and leaves no room for interpretation. The Honduran laws in this case functioned in a way that saved a nation from an unconstitutional would be dictator.

NicosNicosNicosNicos: Well, the actors I'm thinking of predate democracy in Latin America, and are generally the real powers, more powerful than the governments of the day. I'm speaking of the rich minority that owns so much and leaves so little to the majorities: the bunch of families that runs Honduras; the handful of surnames that own huge swathes of Argentina's economy, etc.

REALHONDURAS: Amnesty Internation is a Human Rights organisation like i said before if there are human rights violations being commited by both sides then they should be investigated, thats where amnesties fuction ends, it is not in there capability nor fuction to interpret the law. For the legal side we can find i in the Congressional report and the report by a firm for the U.N. that concur it was not a coup.

NicosNicosNicosNicos: I was referring to Amnesty's role investigating HR abuses, systematic ones in particular. I do not believe there are two equivalent players in terms of a state-run army and the actions of individuals on the other hand.

chepsoki: If you look at Amnesty International page there are ACCUSATIONS, as realhonduras states, of said repression, but at the same time you can see that If you follow the report from before the removal of Zelaya during Zelaya the HR violations where being committed there as well. It seems to follow a pattern that the police is poorly trained. During Zelaya's administration AI reported many accusations as well, In other words Zelaya's return will not bring a stop to HR accusations.

NicosNicosNicosNicos: That's fair enough as far as it goes. Zelaya's return, or any other move towards democracy, would contribute to removing the state of impunity of a government systematically brutalising the political opposition.

REALHONDURAS: Or Zelayas illegal return will just highten repression something that has been on an upward curve since zelaya took office.

NicosNicosNicosNicos: ...hmm am not convinced I see that picture. I am still curious as to whether in your heart of hearts you genuinely cannot see how the removal of Zelaya was damaging to democracy. In any case, thanks for the courteous exchange we've been having.

REALHONDURAS: To understand the legal removal of Zelaya it would have had to been followed for the last 4 years since he took office not just the last 3 months, Thank you for taking the time to point out your point of view.

tomilia: MICHELETTI: fai schifo, vattene, scompari, CREPA!!!! VIVA ZELAYA!!!!!

Crusader4ever1: Gracias Micheletti...es el Heroe de Honduras...con corage en contra el comunismo de HUGO CHAVEZ...PUNTO FINAL.

Crusader4ever1: Que dices...contrabando...cuando HUGO CHAVEZ es el REY del FARC...Ya sabemos de sus drogas y contrabando acceptable de su gobierno!

Author: TheRealNews; Uploaded: Nov 5, 2009; Duration: 11:34; Views: 2709

Tags: tegucigalpa accords san jose zelaya micheletti shannon state dept clinton obama d'etat golpe golpista chavez lula independent interflora international dialing codes internet explorer 8 ing direct in the night garden internet speed test innkeepers lodge infinity ward inland revenue

Nothing Resolved in Honduras Video

Recent posts